Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

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Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  FinnMacCumhail on Tue Jun 07, 2011 6:59 am

Alpha 03 AI is very very stupid, in EB it was more adequate. What can we do about it? Perhaps change descr_formations_ai.txt? But how? I remember in EB for Alex.exe preview it was shown that AI was flanking user from two wings at the same time. What other measures?
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  Cute Wolf on Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:16 am

I can do something with descr_formations_ai

just give me the historical formation use for each factions and I'll try to give some tweaks...
(and sonic spends his time in "jail" near here, should be easy to contact him tommorow)

(actually it's kinda some form of religious sanctuary, he gonna try to become real Christian this time)
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  FinnMacCumhail on Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:30 am

I thought he explores the tropical forests in the quest of indigenous peoples.

Historical formations? Well it is clear with Romans. My knowledge of others style is zero. But Sweboz should have wedge formation (big wedge from units). Perhape we must wait for our historians
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  Cute Wolf on Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:38 am

FinnMacCumhail wrote:I thought he explores the tropical forests in the quest of indigenous peoples.

Historical formations? Well it is clear with Romans. My knowledge of others style is zero. But Sweboz should have wedge formation (big wedge from units). Perhape we must wait for our historians
allready coming back with a lot of money and spent most of it for prostitutes, stupid isn't?
now, he want to repent his sins for some reasons. This time is rather serious, I hope

EDIT:
hmm, creating wedge formations is rather easy, and tell the spear-point units to head towards the weakest line points for attack is easy, the problem is, will sweboz use hard point wedge (heavy armoured infantry in the front), or light one (overwhelm with numbers of light infantry first)

---

btw, maybe I"ll change some EDU designations as well, heavy infantry should be put on units with good armour, lest they'll get in wasted positions. No matter how heavy the weapon is (2 handed axe for somparison), in formations, if the armour is rather light compared to missile attacks, they should get light infantry designations, unless you want AI to use them suicidally
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  gamegeek2 on Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:42 pm

Just don't be a fucking idiot. No need to repent or that bullshit...

Finn did you see the new EDU? It fixes the behavior somewhat.

Club infantry should go at the front of the wedge...but I don't think we can do that.
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  Cute Wolf on Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:53 pm

gamegeek2 wrote:Just don't be a fucking idiot. No need to repent or that bullshit...

Finn did you see the new EDU? It fixes the behavior somewhat.

Club infantry should go at the front of the wedge...but I don't think we can do that.

said that to someone who nearly got himself involved in legal matters Laughing at least he must put something for the drama Evil or Very Mad

hmm... club inf is light infantry yes? it can be arranged, but won't stop any other light infantry to stand in front as well
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  FinnMacCumhail on Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:22 pm

@gg2 I downloaded new EDU but haven't tried yet, and have you downloaded fixes for medium tarantino spears and garamantine chariots?

@CW, different units have diffeent speed. Is it possible that the wedge formation would be broken? Also, there should be some alternative formation for stacks where heavy infantry prevail, with more tight formation, shield walls, "sweboz phalanx" behaving as phalanx. Is it possible that AI would choose formations judjing from army composition?

In descr formations there is a line unit_type specifies units that can be allocated to the block. Is it possible to add an entry there for wedge units?

any
phalanx
non_phalanx_spear
chanting_screeching
ranged_missile_infantry
elephants
heavy_chariots
pilum_infantry
general_unit
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  Cute Wolf on Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:36 pm

FinnMacCumhail wrote:any
phalanx
non_phalanx_spear
chanting_screeching
ranged_missile_infantry
elephants
heavy_chariots
pilum_infantry
general_unit

any is self explanatory
phalanx is spearmen that also has "phalanx" attribute
nonphalanx spear is obvious
ranged missile infantry = non thrown attribute missile infantry (bows and slings)
elephants= obvious
heavy chariots = obvious
light chariots = obvious
pilum infantry = using pilum missile type and precursor
prec infantry = precursor infantry
general_unit = obvious
heavy infantry = heavy infantry type
light infantry = obvious
heavy cavalry = obvious
skirmishers = skirmish infantry/cavalry (set this on unit type)
skirmish infantry = obvious
skirmish cavalry = obvious
and much more types

wedge units? dunno if there's some wedge attribute outside of cavalry, but wedge can be assigned on cavalry I know...

BTW, is there some shield-wall formations?
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  gamegeek2 on Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:07 am

Shield wall needs to go on quite a few units. I will do that at some later point, but the Sweboz' (and probably Lugiones') main order of battle was in a sort of wedge-formation, or in a shieldwall.

Club infantry can be used suicidally, they are supposed to be fierce, religiously affiliated warriors that are also big, brawny Germanic and Baltic men with clubs. They should have a very powerful charge, with good melee but not as good as if they had an axe or mace. Also we want the AI to pit the clubmen against heavy opponents.

Definitely we want a wedge with the heaviest, strongest troops at the tip. Those would be the Isernabando, the clubmen, and the swordsmen. The thick part would be the spear infantry. Skirmishers would be out in front.
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  gamegeek2 on Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:10 am

BTW is it possible to differentiate formations between factions? Because we know the army setup style of the Hashmonayim, or at least I think we do.

I can't find an appropriate translation of the war scroll for reading, so I'm just piecing this from Keravnos' preview/descriptions. If we can get him back for this, it'd be great.

Thureophoroi Bareis along with the Ioudaioi Thorakitai and Makkabaioi Zelotai are the “Men of the rule” consisting of the last two infantry lines of the Jewish infantry as that is described in the Army of the Sons of light scroll found in eleven caves in and around the ruins of the ancient settlement of Qumran on the northwest shore of the Dead Sea.

So the spearmen are in the back of the formation.

“He had, moreover, eight thousand front-line fighters, whom he called "hundred-fighters," carrying long shields covered with bronze.” -Josephus

Heavy infantry (including the Ekatonamachoi) in the front.

I'm not sure about this, but then I'd guess the light infantry (including troops like the Machairophoroi) would go in the middle? The missile infantry would go in the front, with the Euzonoi behind the slingers and archers.
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Re: Alpha 03 AI is very stupid. What to do?

Post  Cute Wolf on Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:19 am

sadly not, the unit differentiation, if they're both spearmen and precursor, the engines can't differentiate them.
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